Re: Ears under pressure. Was Re: Aquatic ape theory

H. M. Hubey (
8 Nov 1995 20:47:53 -0500 (Phillip Bigelow) writes:

> It does if you view "complexity" as a whole-istic entity. Complexity can
>be defined a multitide of ways, which, as is the case with
>"evolutionary-direction", is essentially meaningless.

Lots of things can be defined in lots of ways but neither complexity,
nor efficiency, nor direction are meaningless.

> You just put ONE criterium as the definition for "complexity": our large
>brains. That has an ominous tone of the Old Testament view of man as the
>"apex" of what life is all about. Fine. I choose a more technical

I don't like the way some people try to have their cake and eat it
too. On the one hand we are animals; on the other hand we are not.

Birds' nests are natural, and beaver dams are natural but cities
are not. Lions hunt, foxes hunt, eagles hunt... it's all OK but
when we hunt, it's unnatural. Animals kill; it's natural. When
we kill, it's unnatural. Honey is natural but sugar is not....

We are more complex because our society is more complex. Everything
about is more complex. The world belongs to us and in the future
the solar system will belong to us too, and maybe even beyond.

That makes us advanced and complex. one way or the other
I don't care about either bacteria or animals. If we are all
animals/entitities and equal, then we are in competetion and if
we win, that's tough luck for the rest of them. Hell with bacteria
and virusus.Ditto for other animals. We'll either farm themm
or put them in zoos (or test tubes). The only arguments against
it are practical ones i.e. we don't know enough yet. True.

>definition: one that embraces adaptation, geological longevity, species
>diversity, structural apomorphies, how many niches a species can fill, etc.

>Have you ever looked at the number of chemical steps there are during the
>process of photosynthesis?

Do they make fat and store it in their livers :-).. Do they make
chemicals in factories like we do? Do they talk? Do they
write music? Do they make rocket ships?

Why are you trying to convince people that plants and
bacteria are more complex than humans?


Regards, Mark