Re: The Origin of The Cravat (Was: Are Ties Phallocarps?)

Gerold Firl (
27 Nov 1995 13:09:48 -0800

In article <491jfj$> (Lennart Regebro) writes:

>In article <>, says...

>>I will restate the hypothesis: at some point in the human evolutionary
>>past, penis size became a male status-determinant which functioned as a
>>conflict-resolution mechanism; big dick goes first, you might say. The
>>necktie activates this instinctive mechanism.

>Nope, because then many more of the clothes around the world should have some
>kind of phallocorp attributes. I can't see them.

I can't think of any either, though I could add the watch chain and
military decorations to the list for western culture.

>Interesting hypothesis, but after think about it, I can't see anything that
>argues for it.

I've mentioned a few already, which I won't repeat.

How about "grandfather" clocks, with a big old pendulum swinging from side
to side? Why are they called grandfather clocks? Whips and riding crops
have been/are used as signs of dominance. I'm just throwing out ideas here.
How about the censor used in catholic and eastern orthodox ceremony? I
think the side-to-side waggle might be one of the IRM's.

>The sword most surely was a dominance marker. But so is an expensive
>wristwatch, and I can't se anything phallocarp about that.

Me neither. But humans are very flexible and resourceful. We shouldn't
expect anything as important as dominance markers to be limited to a single
mechanism; besides, according to this hypothesis, we're talking about an
archaic instinct which goes way back into our evolutionary past. In some
ways, culture acts to circumvent these kinds of instincts, to replace them
with mechanisms which are better-suited to current resource-gathering
systems. These days, the size of a mans watch is a better measure of his
reproductive potential than the size of his penis.

Disclaimer claims dat de claims claimed in dis are de claims of meself,
me, and me alone, so sue us god. I won't tell Bill & Dave if you won't.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=---- Gerold Firl @ ..hplabs!hp-sdd!geroldf