Re: Is white racism nec. all bad?

Gary Strand (
17 Apr 1995 17:51:55 GMT

jo> John Otteson
gs> Gary Strand

jo> Look at the context those communities were in. Why were they affected so
severely? Why were they more fragile than other communities? To me, the
answer is "400 years of white racism."

gs> Why? Were these communities *that* fragile? Look at Japanese-American com-
munities in California - they were destroyed by US government actions dur-
ing WWII. They seem to have recovered. Why?

jo> Do you see any difference between 4 years and 400 years? I do.

I see. To take another example, the Nazis, in a few years, obliterated, lit-
erally, the Jewish communities of Poland, to the point that they have never
returned, and probably never will. Just because something took place in a
few years doesn't mean it isn't as devastating as something that took cen-

Besides, the history of blacks in the US is not one of 400 years of unre-
lenting, virulent, widespread, violent racism on the part of whites. Do
you agree or disagree?

jo> You have not answered the question as to why the communities were so fra-

You made that claim, not me. It's up to you to prove their fragility.

jo> Is it possible that the effects of 400 years of systematic racism might
linger? It seems ridiculous to assume that the effects would just disap-
pear over night.

I've made no such claim. Jews don't blame all their problems on ~3000 years
of anti-Semitism. Why should I take your opinions of 400 years of racism
more seriously than theirs?

jo> It is possible that there are negative side-effects of welfare.

"Possible"? Actual.

jo> However, to blame all problems on Welfare is overly-simplistic.

Again, I never said that. It's *part* of the problem, just as white racism
is *part* of the problem.

gs> I don't believe blacks are entirely blameless victims here.

jo> What blame do you want to put on blacks?

Well, howzabout lack of fathers? Black-on-black fratricide? It's *easy* to
blame everything on white racism, but that's a copout and not realistic. I
am not so sure that you're as anti-racist as you claim to be. I think I'd
rather have an overt racist spitting on me than someone who claims that I'm
a poor victim and treats me like a baby. Is it better to break a spine or
believe someone doesn't have one?

jo> Now do you want to divert the discussion to NatAm?

No, just illustrating that government aid isn't a panacea and can introduce

gs> [E]ducation is the key to progress in this post-industrial age. Too bad
some people think getting an education is a white thang.

jo> Why does that unhealthy attitude exist? How did it develop?

I don't know, ask those who believe it. Then again, they'll probably give
you the answers you want.

Gary Strand WWW: PO Box 3000 Boulder CO 80307-3000 (303) 497-1336
Opinions stated here are mine alone and are not those of NCAR, UCAR, or the NSF